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	<title>Comments on: Finding my voice</title>
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	<description>learning how to teach how to learn</description>
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		<title>By: surprisesaplenty</title>
		<link>http://surprisesaplenty.wordpress.com/2010/03/08/finding-my-voice/#comment-29</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[surprisesaplenty]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Mar 2010 20:57:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://surprisesaplenty.wordpress.com/?p=45#comment-29</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#039;s been a while since I wrote this post.  I read your comments on the moderation  page, then raced here to be sure I hadn&#039;t been insulting.  Whew, I&#039;m safe.  I, too, like the idea of a test of english creation rather than absorption.  Thanks for the update and further info.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s been a while since I wrote this post.  I read your comments on the moderation  page, then raced here to be sure I hadn&#8217;t been insulting.  Whew, I&#8217;m safe.  I, too, like the idea of a test of english creation rather than absorption.  Thanks for the update and further info.</p>
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		<title>By: joe</title>
		<link>http://surprisesaplenty.wordpress.com/2010/03/08/finding-my-voice/#comment-28</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[joe]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Mar 2010 13:12:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://surprisesaplenty.wordpress.com/?p=45#comment-28</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Here is what I was talking about (From http://www.sookmyung.ac.kr/wiz/contents/board/board0/board_view.php)

Sookmyung University was chosen as the developing university of the National English Proficiency Test (NEPT) at the consortium in which our university, the Korean Chamber of Commerce and Industry, Seoul National University, Korean University, and Hankuk University of Foreign language participated.

The National English Proficiency Test is the test through which the Korean government is planning to replace TOEIC, TOEFLE, and other types of English language examinations. NEPT is integrating the strengths of the Multimedia Assisted Test of English (MATE) of Sookmyung Women&#039;s University, TEPS of Seoul National University and FLEX of Hankuk University of Foreign Language which are the three major official tests.


Although MATE is the only official English test which evaluates test takers&#039; speaking and writing abilities unlike Seoul National University&#039;s TEPS which evaluates reading and listening abilities, it has not been actively used outside the Sookmyung campus because of its complicated test taking system.  However, we expect that we will play a crucial role in the NEPT developing process, for it is going to include speaking and writing sections in which Sookmyung University has specialized. Meanwhile, we are to come up with ideas to minimize inconveniences MATE causes students to meet the required qualifications for graduation.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here is what I was talking about (From <a href="http://www.sookmyung.ac.kr/wiz/contents/board/board0/board_view.php" rel="nofollow">http://www.sookmyung.ac.kr/wiz/contents/board/board0/board_view.php</a>)</p>
<p>Sookmyung University was chosen as the developing university of the National English Proficiency Test (NEPT) at the consortium in which our university, the Korean Chamber of Commerce and Industry, Seoul National University, Korean University, and Hankuk University of Foreign language participated.</p>
<p>The National English Proficiency Test is the test through which the Korean government is planning to replace TOEIC, TOEFLE, and other types of English language examinations. NEPT is integrating the strengths of the Multimedia Assisted Test of English (MATE) of Sookmyung Women&#8217;s University, TEPS of Seoul National University and FLEX of Hankuk University of Foreign Language which are the three major official tests.</p>
<p>Although MATE is the only official English test which evaluates test takers&#8217; speaking and writing abilities unlike Seoul National University&#8217;s TEPS which evaluates reading and listening abilities, it has not been actively used outside the Sookmyung campus because of its complicated test taking system.  However, we expect that we will play a crucial role in the NEPT developing process, for it is going to include speaking and writing sections in which Sookmyung University has specialized. Meanwhile, we are to come up with ideas to minimize inconveniences MATE causes students to meet the required qualifications for graduation.</p>
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		<title>By: joe</title>
		<link>http://surprisesaplenty.wordpress.com/2010/03/08/finding-my-voice/#comment-27</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[joe]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Mar 2010 13:10:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://surprisesaplenty.wordpress.com/?p=45#comment-27</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[From your friend at a women&#039;s university in Seoul, I&#039;m happy to say that nobody has really read the article.  I mentioned it just this week to one of the Education department professors over lunch, she was surprised to hear about it. Since that article about Sookmyung&#039;s MATE test is written by the venerable Mr.  Kang Shin-who, you can judge its accuracy accordingly.  

Let me point out a few things. 

The exam tests output; students have to write and they have to speak. Students cannot take a cram course and study the test to do better on these skills as they can with the TOEIC or TOEFL tests. This is one reason students don&#039;t like it.

From the article: &quot;MATE candidates receive a ranking from one to 12 for the speaking part and one to seven for the written section. However, there is no scoring table to provide a comparison with other common tests such as the TOEIC or TEPS. &quot;
    Of course there is no comparison because neither TOEIC nor TEPS tests for writing/speaking.

It is an expensive test to administer because every test is checked twice by raters, and if there is a discrepancy in ratings, a third rater checks the test. The raters are paid 3,000 per writing test and 4,000 per speaking. To be certified, one must undergo two eight hour training sessions and accurately rate some sample tests. 

I think it is human nature to put something unpleasant off for as long as possible. The students are human, so they put off taking the mandatory graduation text until their senior year. They have mandatory English classes their freshmen year. That means that most of them forget much of what they learned in class. (Then they blame the exam for being bad, and the university for not preparing them.)

The exam is free for students the first time they take it. If they fail and have to take it again, then they have to pay for it. 

The article quotes students who say that the university promised to make changes by February, but has not taken any action. This is not true at all. As of this semester, the MATE is given as the final exam for the Freshmen courses. Additionally, the test is slightly shorter, though is assessed following the same criteria as the full MATE.  However, the change goes into effect for incoming freshmen for this semester. Older students--the ones who have been complaining--still have to take the full exam. And they will probably put it off for as long as possible.

The article ends with the statement that Seoul National University has the TEPS, which &quot;has gained wider acceptance.&quot;  The only reason it has gained wider acceptance is because it comes from Seoul Nat&#039;l. What the article doesn&#039;t mention is that the MATE, TEPS, and Hanguk University of Foreign Studies exam are all being merged into one exam that is to be used as a graduation English exam for the whole country, one that includes speaking, listening, reading, and writing. If that doesn&#039;t say something for it&#039;s validity, I don&#039;t know what does.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From your friend at a women&#8217;s university in Seoul, I&#8217;m happy to say that nobody has really read the article.  I mentioned it just this week to one of the Education department professors over lunch, she was surprised to hear about it. Since that article about Sookmyung&#8217;s MATE test is written by the venerable Mr.  Kang Shin-who, you can judge its accuracy accordingly.  </p>
<p>Let me point out a few things. </p>
<p>The exam tests output; students have to write and they have to speak. Students cannot take a cram course and study the test to do better on these skills as they can with the TOEIC or TOEFL tests. This is one reason students don&#8217;t like it.</p>
<p>From the article: &#8220;MATE candidates receive a ranking from one to 12 for the speaking part and one to seven for the written section. However, there is no scoring table to provide a comparison with other common tests such as the TOEIC or TEPS. &#8221;<br />
    Of course there is no comparison because neither TOEIC nor TEPS tests for writing/speaking.</p>
<p>It is an expensive test to administer because every test is checked twice by raters, and if there is a discrepancy in ratings, a third rater checks the test. The raters are paid 3,000 per writing test and 4,000 per speaking. To be certified, one must undergo two eight hour training sessions and accurately rate some sample tests. </p>
<p>I think it is human nature to put something unpleasant off for as long as possible. The students are human, so they put off taking the mandatory graduation text until their senior year. They have mandatory English classes their freshmen year. That means that most of them forget much of what they learned in class. (Then they blame the exam for being bad, and the university for not preparing them.)</p>
<p>The exam is free for students the first time they take it. If they fail and have to take it again, then they have to pay for it. </p>
<p>The article quotes students who say that the university promised to make changes by February, but has not taken any action. This is not true at all. As of this semester, the MATE is given as the final exam for the Freshmen courses. Additionally, the test is slightly shorter, though is assessed following the same criteria as the full MATE.  However, the change goes into effect for incoming freshmen for this semester. Older students&#8211;the ones who have been complaining&#8211;still have to take the full exam. And they will probably put it off for as long as possible.</p>
<p>The article ends with the statement that Seoul National University has the TEPS, which &#8220;has gained wider acceptance.&#8221;  The only reason it has gained wider acceptance is because it comes from Seoul Nat&#8217;l. What the article doesn&#8217;t mention is that the MATE, TEPS, and Hanguk University of Foreign Studies exam are all being merged into one exam that is to be used as a graduation English exam for the whole country, one that includes speaking, listening, reading, and writing. If that doesn&#8217;t say something for it&#8217;s validity, I don&#8217;t know what does.</p>
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